Sixmanfanatic2010
11-man fan
Why are the power rankings the way they are for example how is Eden 4 points ahead of fannindel after fannindel beat them by 45 just 2 weeks ago.
Rankings
- Thread starter Sixmanfanatic2010
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Texlonghorn75
Six-man expert
This week's power rankings were derived by taking the negative square root of the number of victories vs only those teams recently 45'ed by those teams withing a 50-mile radius. Next week's power rankings quotient will be determined by the inverse square root to keep rankings consistent. Just keeping it simple.
Sixmanfanatic2010
11-man fan
Hahahahah
This is what happens when we let computers take over the world. The Toy has now evolved itself into something that nobody can control.
Seriously, though, it's just because Fannindel started the season rated too low and haven't really played enough equal opponents to get themselves to an accurate rating. Eden was the best team they've played so far. They gained a LOT of rating points for that game. Likewise, Eden lost quite a few after that game. Eden made up almost all the rating points they lost after the Fannindel game when they beat Bronte.
This system doesn't know Eden got 45'd by Fannindel. It takes the scores from the games and each team's current rating, does some kind of fancy calculations on them (probably exactly what @Texlonghorn75 was talking about), and returns a new rating. It doesn't know anything about the teams other than that. It's definitely not a perfect system but I've spent the better part of the last four years trying to make it better and I've failed at every turn.
Tom Duncan
Six-man fan
The toy cant see injuries from one week to the next or see when an injured impact player returns to the team. Its easier for a program to predict 11 man teams power ranking in my opinion due to the fact that one player's absence or presence is not normally as game changing as it can be in 6 man. Also, some teams just match up differently versus different types of opponents style of play and most computer programs do not take that variable into account.
Is it possible to have some human input into the toy as variables like I outlined occur during the season?
Sixmanfanatic2010
11-man fan
I see that obviously but on a shear points to schedule basis. Injury’s are what they are.
There is almost 300 teams tracked in 6-man. It would be near impossible to factor in those variables with human input. 11-man programs are much simpler because most have a staff of 16+ coaches, statisticians, etc. There aren’t many 6-man schools that have the privilege of live-tracking or up to date season stats because many teams are rolling with 2-4 coaches. At the end of the day - this isn’t college football, and ranking doesn’t impact a team making playoffs - it’s just something us football nerds like to evaluate.
SimplyPut
Six-man pro
Human Input? That is plain scary. Humans can build and configure the program, but once their opinion starts influencing the result you can throw it all out the window.
How bout instead of worrying about your rankings being wrong in yiur opinion, you just go practice harder get better and win your games. Too many feelings hurts over the toy not Making little johhny feel better about himself or daddy over a number that means nothing on Friday night. Mike has done an amazing job and has not failed miserably ar anything.
It's definitely possible, and something I've considered. However, I'm not sure it's something worth attempting at this time. We'd need to get the info from all, or at least most, of the schools. Considering how hard it is to track down some scores from week to week, I'd imagine that would be an almost impossible task. Then if you did get the injury information, you have to determine how much impact each player makes to a team. I think we could all agree that an injury to a starting lineman is probably not the same as an injury to your spread back, or all-state running back.
Something that'd be more useful, IMO, is finding out if a mercy rule game was over at the half, into the 3rd, or into the 4th. Of course there would be games that end into the 3rd or 4th, but only because a team was letting their inexperienced guys get some playing time, so those games could cause issues if we let the "when" make too much impact. Also, it would be very important to be able to get that information from all games if that's something that was going to be of any use. Again, not something that's very likely given how hard it is already to just get the scores.
FenceLeaner
Six-man observer
They are wack!! If your team beats the spread and wins, you move down. But teams that win by forfeit and another team that beats a JV move up in the rankings?
Varsity vs JV shouldn’t count for crap nor should a forfeit.
Varsity vs JV shouldn’t count for crap nor should a forfeit.
Texlonghorn75
Six-man expert
The Toy does a real good job of predicting but has a weak spot. The biggest issue in my opinion is the holdover ratings for the top rated teams from the previous season. Most seasons that system of ranking last year's top teams as this year's top team works most of the time but when you have a one hit wonder team like McLean(going from the average to the championship and back to average), all those victories don't carry over well to McLean subsequent teams. Throckmorton is an extreme example of a team that was once a perennial top-rated team(several state championships) that has struggled in recent years. Gordon has had its valleys and is now at the top again. There are exceptions to this of course. My point being once the initial season starting rating is established it places the previous years top ranked teams at an advantage, an advantage they haven't really earned at that time. I know the Toy is supposed to compensate for all the ins and outs of the pretenders and contenders playing each other during the season but the early season rankings(ratings) advantage persists throughout the season. The West Texas sixman schools present a problem with all the undefeated teams that have not played any common opponents until the playoffs. Who knows who the biggest dog is out west until the playoffs? The private schools are another can of worms and impossible to reasonably rank since they are so diverse. Again, this is not a complaint, just my observation.
SimplyPut
Six-man pro
Mike has a tab marked “FANS” where every single person can go select your own Top 10. Also, you can change your selection each week as you see just how wrong you may have been the previous one. Just a suggestion, but make your own Top 10 each week if you have an issue with the Toy. If you’re truly confident in your abilities screenshot and post that way we can judge you as the season progresses. How fun! LMAO
SimplyPut
Six-man pro
Forgot about this, at the bottom of the fan polls is “Other teams receiving votes” that did not quite make the Top 10. Quite interesting some of them are.
SimplyPut
Six-man pro
You know you may be on to something here with the wack thing. That dang 2 time defending State Champ Gordon that is the clear favorite to 3-peat is ranked #1 overall and has been all season. Even more, there really is not a close 2nd if you go by their rating. But according to the NUMBERS they are the 28th top offense and 17th top defense in six-man football. I’m making a point here if y’all can figure it out.
WV Backer
Six-man pro
I would just tell you FenceLeaner, they're only rankings. They have no bearing, whatsoever, on the playoffs. There is no seeding system in 6-man football like professional tennis or the college football playoff system. Take it for what it's worth and move on.
Tigerfan85
Six-man master
Exactly
FenceLeaner
Six-man observer
Oh I am. And at face value they aren’t worth a lot. Lol. I’ve never seen a system that moves a team up in rankings when they get a forfeit win. Or a team that beats a JV team and moves up.
That right there tells me the rankings are about worthless.
SimplyPut
Six-man pro
You’re correct, they mean nothing but sure give us something to talk about. How about that collapse of a National title contender and pre-season ranked #1 team in the Country that also held the Heisman favorite….Guns Up! Apologies to the founder of this site!
Forfeit wins are treated the same as a 45 in this system, just like they have been since I acquired the site in 2021, and I'm sure many years before that. A team can move up beating any team, JV or otherwise, especially if they beat the spread in the game. Even if they don't beat the spread, teams can move up and down based on what their previous opponents do. If TeamA gets 20 rating points for beating TeamB in week 1, then TeamB continues to fall down the rankings, then some of those 20 points that TeamA got will be taken away from them in later weeks.
Also important to note that just because you see a team move up in the rankings doesn't mean that they actually even moved up in rating. A team could lose rating points and still move up in rankings. It could be that a team, or teams, above them dropped enough rating points that they moved down below them. If someone goes down, that means someone else has to go up.
