Two Year Honeymoon: Is It Over

  • Thread starter Thread starter BE
  • Start date Start date
BE":2xuc4lhu said:
A good point that needs to be made is one I heard today...some of those schools that made the 104 cutoff actually have more than the number turned in because of the different formulas available to calculate their ADA. But most of the small sixman school numbers are exactly what they turn in. For example, Follett turns in 54 and that number is accurate, but a Class 2A can manipulate their number down below 104 even though the real number is higher. Therefore, schools around 50 could be competing against schools with 135 or 140. That's like saying a class 2A with 200 kids would have to compete against schools with 21/2 or3 times more, 4 or 5 hundred kids.

And even tho Follett girls have won a couple of Regional championships recently, the boys surely have not. But during that two year Follett run the girl's finished second or lower twice to Whitedeer who had many more run-and-jumpers than our team. Two years ago we had seven girls in HS track, last year six and this year seven or eight. As I said earlier, that is the exception, not the norm.
Click to expand...

I don't think you are accurate about the number turned in. 11man schools can only count 9-12, they don't get to use all the formulas that we (6man) schools use.
 
I have been associated with many sports in my young life. In any of the other sports such summer baseball, youth basketball, youth football, motocross, wrestling and rodeo, if a team or individual chooses to "play up," most generally because of age, then that team or individual "plays up." A young man competing in bull riding can be 14 and choose to ride in a 16-19 year old group. However, if they do, then they will have to compete at that level in any other event they choose to compete in. In addition, if a 2A school chooses to play up a division in 3A, then from I what I understand, they have to compete in the 3A division in all sports. There should not be any difference in the 1A division in my opinion. Some schools who have chosen to drop to 6 man have struggled, while others have prospered. There is a cutoff # for a reason. If schools are "too good" to play real football, then they should be "too good" to compete in the other uil events. I think the competition is welcome in track and the other sports. I think it all boils down to a pride thing.
 
Jones26 may be right, I don't know. That point was made by someone who has been around for a while, so perhaps I misinterpreted his point.

Like anything else it all boils down to a mindset...guys like us will have to adjust our approach somewhat. We will also have to improve our tools and provide better facilities for our kids. Sand-gravel, dirt or hard-top tracks can be a disadvantage in a sport that often comes down to photo finishes and hundreds of a second. lack of proper training has to be overcome.

When my son played sixman it was all so very easy for him, his teammates and us coaches to prepare for every season, game and play because of the talent level available. However, a very subtle flaw was being perpetrated which would handicap the two or three who had the ability to go the next level, and that was a lack of 11-man style training that they would need in college. In six years at RS we never established six o'clock weight training nor a heavy emphasis on BFS style lifting. And we were rarely "gung-ho" type coaches who filled the air with hoop and hollering to "fire up" the guys to a rabid frenzy as so many college programs exhibit. So when Tyler and Mark arrived to their first days of college training, well, it was culture shock to say the least. And before long they were feeling over their heads.

To sum it all up, we will have to run a better long-term program if we want to be competitive against the larger schools. We will have to approach track like the Spartans approached warfare: when the enemy arrive in their fancy buses loaded with dozens of athletes, we will proudly raise our heads and proclaim, " This is SIXMAN" ! (:
 
There is a world of difference in coaching football and coaching track. Coaching is about 75 percent of success in football. My estimate is coaching is about 20 percent of success in track.
In track, if you have a kid with speed, you will be successful. Coach the starts and handoffs and win the sprints and 4x100 relay. Work on conditioning and win the 400.

So, to get the kid or kids with speed, you need numbers.
To get the winning relay, you need more numbers, or be lucky and have 4 come along at the right time in the small numbers.
The schools with the most kids are always going to be the toughest overall in track.
 
BE I agree with all that. It's hard to compete without a track. That mindset is the mindset we ought to have GATA! WE ARE SIX MAN!

Johnny I agree it's good to have numbers. Unless those numbers are all slow. You can win a track meet with 6 or 7 fast ones. At the last few meets leading to state you can win with 4 or 5. You can even win state with one kid. Rochelle did a few years ago. But between you and me, I' might give up a district championship to win the area meet and get one relay to state. (I'd prefer both, though). That's what's great about track, you can be dead last at the district meet but still get to go to Austin if you have one good kid. We've won quite a few district championships here, only to get beat at area and regionals by teams in my district that had better relays or more faster girls. Because state is the goal. Whether you have one or 10. Goin to Austin is the best part of track, and because of the new division, we have more of a chance.
 
In any other classification in Texas if you opt to go up 2A to 3A then you are in that classification for everything. It's not about the numbers and if this school is better then us, it comes down to the fact that UIL needs to be consistent on all their rules. It is as simple as that.

But then again it is the state of Texas and UIL and anything under 4A really doesn't seem to matter to any of them.
 
The honeymoon is over of course. I cant wait to see that next six man school shine in Austin. It was a glorious thing to watch Trent, Rochelle, Rule and Blum shine against the larger 11 man schools. I will always enjoy a true David vs. Goliath matchup.

Go Hickory Hoosiers! Did I get that name right?
 
It's been this way in basketball for years - at least on the 6-man level. Schools that opted to play up in football played basketball with their proper classification. One need look no further than Naz for a prime example.

Now track is an issue?

Seems to me that some people need something to complain about and would likely gripe if they were hung with a new rope.
 
For several alignments I have presented a proposal to the UIL about an alignment which would be fairer to all schools. My proposal involves having 6 divisions among 11-man schools and two divisions among six man schools. This is for football, basketball, track and spring academic meet. If we are already dividing the football into two divisions, it only makes sense to have the division among other events. I do agree that a school opting to play up in one sport should have to stay in that division for all sports, as that is already the rule in all other divisions.
 
I don't really understand this discussion. The schools in question are under 104.5. They are eligible to play to play 6-Man football but choose to play 11-Man with their small numbers. They have no real advantage in number of kids. They may get more out because they need everyone to be able to field an 11-Man team. All that being said, I do believe that if you choose to play up in one sport you should have to play up in all. I know the UIL has had schools choose to play 5-A with 4-A numbers to alleviate travel distances. I believe they had to play 5-A everything.
 
for people saying its the same as 4a playing up to 5a it really isnt.. its two different brands of football.. 6man to 11man is nowhere near the same as 11man 4a to 11man 5a.. completely different situation.. if they are under the 104 then its whatever.. already having this 1a like it is now has completely helped most sixman track programs as most of these times (run by 11man 1a's or 6man 1a's) would really struggle to compete at the 2a level.. so be THANKFUL for that
 
Here are some interesting facts from this past weekend's Class-A UIL state track meet.

79 sixman schools sent competitors to Austin
38 of them sent one athlete
20 sent two
4 sent 10 to 13: Water Valley, Sterling City, Blum and Ira

The new drop-downs I mentioned
16 from Munday
12 from Burton
10 from Wink
8 from Springlake-Earth

Water Valley won Boys' division and Burton and Cross Plains tied for Girls' championship.
Follett and Ira Girls tied for second.
Munday Girls could have been champion had they not dropped the baton in the 4x400 relay.

This info is not perfectly correct. I threw it together on the drive home Saturday. I was not there for the final two events, so my final results are based on another person's info.
But if accurate it can be used to argue both sides of the debate.

2014 Division l Results:

Girls: Boys:
Munday----3 pts. Munday----14 pts.
Burton-----0 pts. Burton-----0 pts.
Spglake-Earth----0 pts. Spglake-Earth----0 pts.
Wink--------0 pts. Wink-------0 pts.

Might be some motivation there.
 
Your assumption is skewed. Burton boys won their district, area and regional track meet and then finished 21st at state. Munday finished second as a team, but had they been in Region 2 their 1600 relay wouldn't have even been there (if you are looking at Regional times).

I think taking 6 out of the top 10 from the boys side is pretty stinking good, but what do I know.
 
Mister, If the truth were known I'm probably skewed in more places than just my assumptions.
Well then, no more half measures. You got me fired up, boy!! "Let's damn the torpedoes and full steam ahead" all year and get after these big boys ...football too. Come on King Kong, why play 6 on 6 all summer when by adding just one single kid we can challenge Munday and Canadian in the statewide 7 on 7 league. In roundball all you beasts step up like Paducah and Nazareth and play up with the likes of Smyer and Munday. Lets get in there with the baseball and softballers and test our metal with Clarendon, Gruver and soon to be Canadian Wildcats.

We can beat lots of them. We will be competitive, but the average small school will find it tough against the average bigger school. How many more will choose to compete in Class A the next cycle? Looks like there are a couple dozen more schools that are on the bubble. Move them all to Class A ?

I want more than just six or eight small school teams year in and year out to have a taste of glory in athletics. I hope we can continue to find a way to spread just a tiny bit of success to fifteen or twenty or even twenty-five schools. That is the entire purpose for having more than one division.

Let these eleven-man schools take care of themselves, play AA across the board, or talk the UIL into a Division ll track. Who says we all have to crowd into the same stadium two weeks after the Regional Meets. It would take a half ounce of imagination and "3.14 meters" of vision to form a better plan. (:

It really never was a honeymoon, more like an affair, which never last. ):

"If you don't have the skills there's always eleven-man"
 
Just to add to the discussion, Munday girls have 3 freshmen that make up a bulk of their relays. They would not have made it to state in division 2 last year. You can also add Cross Plains as an 11 man school.
 
Back
Top