What is a horse-collar tackle?

C

coachsatcher

Six-man fan
For the third time this season, I have been given a different explanation of a horse-collar tackle.


1. Any tackle where the defender grabs the offensive player anywhere between the shoulders, on his back, and drags the player down from behind.
2. Same as #1, but the defender must have their body contact the back of the offensive players legs during the tackle.
3. Defender's hand must have inside contact with the back/upper portion of the offensive players shoulder pads "collar", and be drug down from behind.

I have been penalized for all three at one point of the season, but each time I have asked for an explanation. I have referenced all 3 explanations I received, from other officials, and was told each were wrong by their "colleages". I'm not a conspiracy theorist, but I'm trying to teach my players what not to do; but can't get a clear definition of what's right or wrong. I can't afford these 15 yards penalties and I realize they should basically just not tackle from the back. More importantly, I watch us get tackled the same way and now I'm not even sure when or when not to complain.
 
Im not an official but I might be able to provide a little insight. This is the clarification of a horse-collar;

Horse-collar Tackles – illegal if from the side or back
Rule 9-4-3k
It is a foul to grab the inside back or side collar of the shoulder pads or jersey of the runner and
subsequently pull the runner to the ground. (Foul occurs when the runner is down.)
Examples:
a) Defender grabs the runner’s collar from the back or the side and pulls him down to the back or side. This is a foul whether the player goes immediately to the ground or is ridden for several yards before going down.
b) Defender grabs the runner’s collar from the front and pulls him down. This is not a foul because the collar was not grabbed from the back or side.
c) Defender grabs the runner’s collar and rides him for several yards before he falls forward. This is not a foul. This example comes directly from NFHS. Perhaps the ruling is because there is no buckling of the knees in this situation and it is knee injuries that the rule is intended to reduce.
d) Defender grabs the runner’s collar and while still being held by the collar, a second defender comes in and assists in tackling the runner. This is a judgment call. If the horse collar is responsible for the runner going down, it is a foul. If the second tackle is responsible for the runner going down, there is no foul.
e) Defender grabs the runner’s collar, but the runner breaks away. This is not a foul because the runner did not go down.
f) Defender grabs the back of the runner’s collar and eventually brings him down, but before the runner goes to the ground he scores a touchdown or goes out of bounds. This is a personal foul for unnecessary roughness, but not a horse collar foul because the runner did not go down before the play ended.
g) Defender grabs the jersey at the top of the shoulder area and pulls him down. This in not a foul because the collar was not grabbed.
h) Defender grabs the back collar of the runner and as the runner is going down he fumbles the ball. This is not a horse-collar foul because the player is no longer a runner once he fumbles and therefore when he goes down, it is not the “runner” going down. It may be unnecessary roughness.


Basically comes down to, you can grab the jersey, just not the inside of the shoulder pads from the back or side.

So #3 is probably the best explanation of it. Whoever told you #2 was probably drunk or something.

you might wanna repost this in the ask a ref! thread...maybe you can get a better answer there.

Good Luck!
 
I've got to correct you on something. You correct cite the rule, but then misapply it.

It does not matter if you grab the inside collar of the pads or the inside collar of the jersey. Both qualify for the foul. Tackling using the jersey does qualify for a horsecollar tackle.

This is a tough rule and I can tell you that we officials, unfortunately, often disagree about what qualifies as a horsecollar. Much like "what is a hold," it is a judgment call in many respects and one that is always going to be debated. In many respects, it is one of those "know it when you see it" calls that is difficult to put into writing, but I'll do my best for some key indicators that I see when I throw my flag for a horsecollar.

1. The defender clearly grabs the inside of the pads of the jersey at the back or close to the back on the side.

2. The defender's actions cause an abrupt change in the ball carrier's momentum. Often, this means that his feet, legs, hips, or all three keep going forward when his upper body is suddenly stopped or lurched back.

3. The defender doesn't "ride" the ball carrier forward in the tackle. If he grabs and pulls but the result of the tackle is both of them falling forward, I don't have a foul.

Generally, these tackles are ones that happen in open space when the defender is trying to catch up to a ball carrier that has a step on the defender. A horsecollar tackle should look "bad" and be obvious because the tackle is made with an arm "jerking back" the ball carrier rather than a body-to-body tackle the way that players are coached to tackle someone down.

Like I said, it's one of those judgment call fouls that isn't consistently officiated and is a source of confusion and frustration that I address with coaches on a regular basis. I hope this helps.
 
NCAA Rule 9-1-15

All players are prohibited from grabbing the inside back collar of the shoulder pads or jersey, or the inside follar of the side of the shoulder pads or jersey, and immediately pulling the ball carrier down. This does not apply to a ball carrier, included a potential passer, who is inside the tackle box.
Click to expand...
 
coachsatcher":u01hfrdl said:
For the third time this season, I have been given a different explanation of a horse-collar tackle.


1. Any tackle where the defender grabs the offensive player anywhere between the shoulders, on his back, and drags the player down from behind.
2. Same as #1, but the defender must have their body contact the back of the offensive players legs during the tackle.
3. Defender's hand must have inside contact with the back/upper portion of the offensive players shoulder pads "collar", and be drug down from behind.

I have been penalized for all three at one point of the season, but each time I have asked for an explanation. I have referenced all 3 explanations I received, from other officials, and was told each were wrong by their "colleages". I'm not a conspiracy theorist, but I'm trying to teach my players what not to do; but can't get a clear definition of what's right or wrong. I can't afford these 15 yards penalties and I realize they should basically just not tackle from the back. More importantly, I watch us get tackled the same way and now I'm not even sure when or when not to complain.
Click to expand...

As an official, I can tell you that none of those 3 are the correct explanation. What DOES matter is that the horse collar is a violent change of direction to the ball carrier on an immediate tackle. If the ball carrier does not immediately go down, no horse collar should be thrown. For example, RB #44 breaks thru the line and runs into the secondary. SS #5 grabs onto RB #44 inside his shoulder pads. RB #44 continues to run for two more yards before SS #5 pulls him down backwards. IT IS NOT A HORSE COLLAR because the tackle didn't happen immediately.
 
As an official who spends his daylight hours working as an attorney, you can be sure of two things:

1. I spend a lot of time studying what words actually mean.

2. I'm probably lying.

In all seriousness, I think that what you asking is one way to read the rules, but the wrong way. It isn't that the jerking tackle happens immediately after grabbing the collar, it's that the jerking tackle is an immediate action. As I read and interpret that as an official, the jerking and "pull-down" motion of the tackle has to be swift and immediately. If you grab the ball-carrier and slow him down, pull a little more and knock him off balance, then pull a little more and finally take him down, I don't see that as "immediate."

If you grab him without really changing his momentum much and then two seconds later do an "immediate" jerk and takedown, I think you still have a horsecollar.
 
Stripes":6x5b4h6t said:
As an official who spends his daylight hours working as an attorney, you can be sure of two things:

1. I spend a lot of time studying what words actually mean.

2. I'm probably lying.

In all seriousness, I think that what you asking is one way to read the rules, but the wrong way. It isn't that the jerking tackle happens immediately after grabbing the collar, it's that the jerking tackle is an immediate action. As I read and interpret that as an official, the jerking and "pull-down" motion of the tackle has to be swift and immediately. If you grab the ball-carrier and slow him down, pull a little more and knock him off balance, then pull a little more and finally take him down, I don't see that as "immediate."

If you grab him without really changing his momentum much and then two seconds later do an "immediate" jerk and takedown, I think you still have a horsecollar.
Click to expand...
That has to be the best explanation that I have seen yet.
 
So, what happens if a tackler grabs the inside of the shoulder pads and slings the ball carrier out of bounds without the ball carrier going to the ground. I have had two horse collars called on my players this year where this was the case. Both on 4th and medium where we held them from getting the first down!
 
We had a kid jerked down this weekend and no call was made. When the ref came over he told us that there is no horse-collar between the tackles.. Is this correct? I thought this was a call that is to be made for player safety. Can someone please tell me if this is correct. I sure would hate for some coaches to teach this and start hurting kids.
 
Stripes":bmlpzhuu said:
NCAA Rule 9-1-15

All players are prohibited from grabbing the inside back collar of the shoulder pads or jersey, or the inside follar of the side of the shoulder pads or jersey, and immediately pulling the ball carrier down. This does not apply to a ball carrier, included a potential passer, who is inside the tackle box.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...

That answers one question. There is no such thing as a horsecollar tackle inside the tackle box.

As for the grab and sling, you don't have the jerkdown motion that is immediately and against the momentum of the ballcarrier. That doesn't mean that the tackle couldn't potentially be some other penalty, but not a horsecollar.
 
I had it explained again last night by an official at a Junior High game. He said it has nothing to do with hand placement, except for it having to come from behind. He said it's the "immediate" change of direction and immediately bringing the player down from behind. This has been the most consistent answer from the officials, but is something that definately needs to be addressed so everyone know what is and what isn't a penalty. I'm still good with the "judgement" portion of the play. However, it's extremely frustrating to have something with so many different "opinions", but is consistently called at games with different levels of interpretation. Again, "judgement" is one thing, but having a different "rule" is different. It hasn't been a game-changer for me yet, but is still something I deal with every Friday night. Praying to God an injury doesn't occur on a blatant foul, that doesn't get called, because of mis-interpretations.
 
I had an interesting horse collar call last night also. It was in my favor so I didn't complain of course. My 4'8 90 Lb RB had a huge kid put both hands on the back of his helmet and slam him face first straight in to the ground. He did not grab any pad or the back of his helmet just had his hands on him. Looked pretty violent. It actually busted my kids hard plastic chin strap right down the middle from hitting the ground. Never seen that one before.
 
What you had in that situation cannot, by definition, be a horsecollar tackle. It certainly sounds like a potential candidate for unnecessary roughness, but there's nothing there that qualifies it to be a horsecollar tackle.
 
Let me tell you the new rules for horse collar tackle. This rule applies only for Borden Co. A horse collar is legal if you are losing to an opposing team .Like last night in the first quarter. It is illegal when you are ahead by 21 points. Somebody needs to tell these refs they better call these. Does Borden Co. really have to resort to horse collar tackles when losing to a team like klondike? No, they are so much better than klondike. They did last night though. And it showed , in the first quarter. They were losing control of the game and started to do whatever they had to do to stop a runner, and got away with it . When they got a comfortable lead the horse collars just stopped all of a sudden. It did make a difference and stopped another touchdown at that time. No flag. You refs put yourself in a bad position when you dont call it. Dont call 1-800 RENT A REF for these refs again.Other than that a good game. Klondike would have been in the game if you didnt give up the ball 6-8 times. Is there anybody there that can kick extra points ?
 
JAFO":2b24qent said:
Let me tell you the new rules for horse collar tackle. This rule applies only for Borden Co. A horse collar is legal if you are losing to an opposing team .Like last night in the first quarter. It is illegal when you are ahead by 21 points. Somebody needs to tell these refs they better call these. Does Borden Co. really have to resort to horse collar tackles when losing to a team like klondike? No, they are so much better than klondike. They did last night though. And it showed , in the first quarter. They were losing control of the game and started to do whatever they had to do to stop a runner, and got away with it . When they got a comfortable lead the horse collars just stopped all of a sudden. It did make a difference and stopped another touchdown at that time. No flag. You refs put yourself in a bad position when you dont call it. Dont call 1-800 RENT A REF for these refs again.Other than that a good game. Klondike would have been in the game if you didnt give up the ball 6-8 times. Is there anybody there that can kick extra points ?
Click to expand...

Winners keep on winning, losers complain and make excuses.
 
JAFO":132a8yub said:
Let me tell you the new rules for horse collar tackle. This rule applies only for Borden Co. A horse collar is legal if you are losing to an opposing team .Like last night in the first quarter. It is illegal when you are ahead by 21 points. Somebody needs to tell these refs they better call these. Does Borden Co. really have to resort to horse collar tackles when losing to a team like klondike? No, they are so much better than klondike. They did last night though. And it showed , in the first quarter. They were losing control of the game and started to do whatever they had to do to stop a runner, and got away with it . When they got a comfortable lead the horse collars just stopped all of a sudden. It did make a difference and stopped another touchdown at that time. No flag. You refs put yourself in a bad position when you dont call it. Dont call 1-800 RENT A REF for these refs again.Other than that a good game. Klondike would have been in the game if you didnt give up the ball 6-8 times. Is there anybody there that can kick extra points ?
Click to expand...

If you can get a copy of the film showing what you allege -- blatant one-sided calling and major issues -- please submit it to the officiating chapter to which those officials belonged and let the chapter leadership deal with the issue. Thanks!
 

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