Update: Houston Texas Christian now ELIGIBLE for D-II Play

[freeagent]

Would be interesting if the schools in HTC district simply didn't return phone calls for scheduling.

Could TAPPS say, "We will re-instate you on one condition...the people causing your ban have to go"?

Just curious.

Trouble is two things: first, the game would be considered a forfeit win by HTC for a refusal to play a district game.

Second, the school forfeiting a district game would, by TAPPS rules, be ineligible to participate in the playoffs.

Yes, TAPPS could set a requirement that a school could not employ a given person as a coach/supervisor of TAPPS-sponsored activities (this penalty has been given before and there is at least one person that the TAPPS website mentions cannot do so until he appears before the TAPPS board because of past conduct from 1997-1998). That isn't first-line punishment, though...

John

 

[ACL/MCL]

I dunno about this whole deal. Mandatory practice before the legal starting date? Is that what happened?

I want to get m facts straight before anything else.

 

[freeagent]

I dunno about this whole deal. Mandatory practice before the legal starting date? Is that what happened?

I want to get my facts straight before anything else.

As I understand the issue, it seems that the school held mandatory practices for football and volleyball (3-5 day camps, approx. 2-3 weeks prior to the start of the season) and required attendance for anyone planning to compete in those sports.

The kicker was when the enrollment forms for both camps were posted on the school's web site.

TAPPS allows off-season conditioning (much like UIL), but you cannot make participation required.

 

[ACL/MCL]

That seems pretty shady to me.

Even just one week of 3-5 day practice can give you quite a jump start.

How did they get out of the suspension?

Is this not the same Houston team with the whole college player fiasco?

It seems that they got out of that easy too . . .

TAPPS might be a little too lenient.

 

[CoachBennett5]

Things of this nature are exactly why we do not play private schools anymore. 2 years back we had to cancel our NYOS game because the they are not affiliated with any organization and then the HTC college player fiasco eliminated us from playing any private school in any sport. (unless of course it is a tournament or at a track meet). I believe that is also why it is difficult for charter schools to get games other than district games. There are so many great TAPPS schools in Texas and I think it helps both schools to play one another. It makes the kids better on and off the field. Just my opinion but if the private schools wont police themselves then we will never schedule a private or charter school unless the UIL puts them in one of our districts.

 

[MetroEagles32]

I wouldn't judge ALL private schools just based on HTC. They're a very, very exceptional program as far as underhanded tactics go.

Not that I'm telling you what to do, but I don't see the harm in scheduling TAPPS schools that have a distinguished reputation and have been around for a while. Abilene, Greenville, Happy Hill, Temple Central Texas...I guarantee you wouldn't see the same sort of things from any of those schools.

As far as UIL putting privates in UIL Districts with public schools, it just won't happen. lol Private schools will remain in TAPPS probably forever.

 

[wreckem]

As far as UIL putting privates in UIL Districts with public schools, it just won't happen. lol Private schools will remain in TAPPS probably forever.

I believe Strake Jesuit and Dallas Jesuit are playing UIL. I don't know if six man will ever move in that direction. The Jesuit schools moved for a viariety of reasons, but I can't see small TAPPS schools wishing for that any time soon.

 

[Rdavis]

Bennett, And what are you going to do when some UIL team pulls some kind of garbage like HTC did? Are you not going to schedule them either? That is so silly, to lump all TAPPS schools together. When a school pulls something like that, then you just don't schedule that school. Its that simple.

 

[CoachBennett5]

When it is an adminstrative decision made before my tenure then there is not a whole lot I can do about it. I started coaching at private school and played against CTCS they are a great program with a great christian coach but if the UIL punishes us for playing certain schools then I would not play that school but I am not going against an administrative decision either. If a UIL school had played college players then I guarantee you that they would have been punished more severely then HTC was punished. It is still all about the individual coaches and administration to run a clean program period.

 

[freeagent]

Coach Bennett aludes to an issue that our UIL members have playing CHARTER schools. Austin NYOS is a very-well run charter school (not a private school) which I have had no problem in scheduling them ... and will do so again, in all sports. There are other charter schools (and private schools) where I cannot say that.

UIL rules say that if you play a school elgible for UIL membership and LOSE to that school, you are ineligible for the playoffs in that sport. Since charter schools are elgible for UIL membership (some belong, some do not), any UIL school playing a non-UIL charter school risks its possible playoff position by scheduling that non-UIL charter school.

Can you see the public outcry and job-jeopardy that would result if the undfeated district champion Podunk Public High Potato Farmerscouldn't be in the playoffs because of that 44-41 loss in Zero Week to We Really Wanna Help You Pass Charter Academy Rams over there in Big City? They'd be storming the Coach's, AD's, Principal and Superintendent's houses with torches and pitchforks. Moving vans would soon follow.

(The rule, as I understand it, long predates charter schools. My guess is that it was passed to prevent public schools from leaving the UIL, but one of the wiser UIL sages can confirm it for me.)

I can understand why some public schools have a "no private school" rule. It's because one (or more) of our fellow private schools have shown themselves to be poor sportsmen or unreliable. There are many of us who can prove that school to be the exception to the rule, but I guess nobody at that district wants to deal with the issue anymore ... and if you have enough public school opponents for non-district play, then you don't have to change that rule.

John

 

[CoachBennett5]

Just like the old saying, " a few bad apples can spoil the whole bunch." It can also happen to charter schools currently in UIL ie Dallas I am that I am Academy. I believe the UIL has banned them from certain sports for a couple of years.

 

[Rdavis]

Bennett, are you saying in the history of the UIL that no school has ever been caught cheating? Or no coach has ever bent the rules? Give me a break. UIL schools and coaches are getting disciplined every year for all kinds of violations. It seems too convenient to lump all the non-UIL teams together. What are we trying to teach our kids? That its ok to judge everyone on the merits of another in their group.

 

[CoachBennett5]

Exactly schools get punished. If will read my ealier post, I wrote , "It all comes down to administators and coaches policing thier programs." We dont schedule private schools, non-affiliated charter schools, home schools, or TAPPS outlaw sixman schools with 100 plus enrollment to protect our kids and our school. TAPPS and 99.9% of thier membership are great programs and great examples. We are going to play schools who have to follow the same rules we follow and have the same consequences we would have if we violate any of those rules. Also, my school age children attend a private school in Marble Falls.

 

[freeagent]

Please note a revision in my first post concerning the level of appeals for on this issue; it was the TAPPS Athletic Committee that overturned the decision of the District Executive Committee.

The TAPPS Board has not heard an appeal by any party.

John

10/17/07

 

[freeagent]

Exactly schools get punished. If will read my ealier post, I wrote , "It all comes down to administators and coaches policing thier programs." We dont schedule private schools, non-affiliated charter schools, home schools, or TAPPS outlaw sixman schools with 100 plus enrollment to protect our kids and our school. TAPPS and 99.9% of thier membership are great programs and great examples. We are going to play schools who have to follow the same rules we follow and have the same consequences we would have if we violate any of those rules. Also, my school age children attend a private school in Marble Falls.

Coach ... I don't want to get this too far off track, but I would put TAPPS' record of policing its members in the past few years up against anything that UIL has done.

A couple years ago, TAPPS put some significant sanctions on at least two basketball programs (San Antonio Cornerstone boys and Carrollton Christian girls, the latter I understand was coached by a gentleman who was an assistant AD for a public school district and arranged for a third-party to provide scholarships for four players at that school; in the following year, Cornerstone did not have its contract for membership accepted by the Board ... which is permitted by TAPPS rules, another way to sort out bad apples, admittedly one not used often and probably shouldn't be).

The original penalty against HTC after the "ringers" game was given by the District Committee. There are good folks that say it was too light, but one of the principals in that action told me that the reason they did what they did was that they did not want to punish the kids; if even one kid from their high school team had suited up for that "game," they would have made the program ineligible.

Is the TAPPS enforcement process "perfect?" Well, no, because it has its limits. TAPPS is a voluntary organization ... with limited resources to investigate ... and any school is able to quit the organization at any time.

I noticed that UIL, which as a part of the University of Texas, is a state organization and has a little more "teeth" in its enforcement abilities ... including a full-time position on staff as "Compliance Officer," and able to work quickly with the only organization in Texas that accredits public schools -- the TEA, again, another state organization ... with legal powers to subpoena folks, etc.

John

 

[mmorvan]

As a spare just reading this stuff: It is interesting to note how a knucklehead has, in some sense or another, caused a "spirited debate" amongst what seem to be decent folks tryng to do it right. While no system is perfect, and there are good and bad apples in every barrel, i would urge you boys not to lose sight of the source of the irritation. It's my opinion that if the kids were to have been punished, for something they had nothing to do with, that would have solved the problem. I don't think too many parents would send their kids to a school, and pay tuition, knowing the owner, AD, head football coach, just knowingly: robbed them financially, robbed their kids of at least a year of their high school experience, etc. If the kids were to have been punished a couple of years ago, my guess is the school wouldn't be in existence today, and none of this would be an issue now. It would suck for the kids, but this years kids would be in a better position, probably somewhere else. It's the old question: How many do you sacrifice today for the greater good tomorrow. The question Ike had to answer many years ago. Oh well...

I think it was Ike, i'm old and my history lessons are beginning to fade...

 

[CoachBennett5]

Great point. It does suck for the kids. If we dont remember our history were are doomed to repeat it. Im just glad 99.9% of the TAPPS schools are good and I will continue to send my children to TAPPS schools. Im lucky though I have a choice between 2 private schools and 2 public schools my kids can attend not everyone has that choice. God bless the coaches that teach this game with their hearts and not their egos.