School that go from 11 man to 6 man

[texas man]

Why are they not successful? Is it that they don’t hire the right coach? Throckmorton, May and Crowell have found success. Gorman’s first year is going pretty smooth. But am talking about those that have not had any success.

 

[Shad Kline]

A couple of different trains of thought on this.

1) Not all teams that are 11 man, going to 6 man are huge schools. Gorman is a great example of this. They have had the numbers to go 6 man for quite some time, but have for whatever reason, continued to play 11 man up until this year. I don't know the exact number, but I'm pretty sure Gorman's number was between 70-75. Same as Gordon. So, a smaller school like that would come in, not any bigger than the teams they are facing, with kids that have never played this type of football, a lot of times, with the same coach they had in 11-man, who is having to learn the game along with the kids. I would attribute Gorman's success to several factors. They are fast, they have the desire to win, they have a great coach.
I don't think this is the norm.

2) Some schools will come in and feel like they will just dominate. They get the big head and then get put in their place. A lot of times, this is with a coach who doesn't really want to play 6-man, but wants a job. He thinks it will be a cake walk compared to 11-man. Then he learns different.

3) Talent. Some schools just don't have talent that year. It's just how it is. They want to be good, they may even have good coaching, but you can only do so much with a potato, even if it's the greatest, kindest, smartest, kind hearted potato that ever existed. It's still only gonna be a french fry. Even the best coaches have years that they just don't have the talent to have a great team.

Your initial question of why are they not successful? Well, sometimes they are. Savoy was the poster child of why a team that can't win or hardly field a team in 11 man should make the switch. They went 10-0 regular season their first year. Won their district, won a playoff game. Didn't lose until they met Gordon in the second round, who went on to the semi-finals and barely lost to a really good Abbott team. Then, Savoy comes out the next year and beats Gordon in the second round. I would say that is a success from a team that was either 1-9 or 0-10 their last year of 11-man. Gorman is the new poster child at 4-0 so far, even though they are playing outlaw and not eligible for playoffs. There are some other schools in the area that are thankful for that, because they would have had a good shot at making it.

Finally, for the teams that come in and are NOT successful..... usually if they keep plugging away at it, they get pretty good and eventually find themselves on the winning side a lot more than the losing side.

 

[Jacket15]

I wish six man officials would make of an effort to respect six man football by learning the rules.
The statement "This my first six man game, I dont know all the rules"
Situation happened last night-----JH/JV contests.

Respect the game---keep that a secret!

 

[smokeyjoe53]

One other thing comes to mind.............the intangibles like tradition, community support, etc. Sixman is NOT just football with 5 fewer players. It is a way of life......... You don't find the same fans in Sixman as you do 11 man nor do you find the same player............

 

[centexfan7]

I wish six man officials would make of an effort to respect six man football by learning the rules.
The statement "This my first six man game, I dont know all the rules"
Situation happened last night-----JH/JV contests.

Respect the game---keep that a secret!

I would rather them "learn" at a JH/JV game than show up at a varsity game and say that. Gotta learn somewhere, JH/JV games are a great place.

 

[Blue Bird]

Winning can be mindset. Throckmorton has had winning teams at every level that they play, so they start playing sixman and make the semifinals the first year and win state the second. Their coach was there before and after the move. He was on a learning curve as much as the kids. Losing can also be a mindset, and it is hard to break that mindset. The Savoys, Throckmorton, and Gormans are fewer than you might think. May was mentioned. They went 0-20 the last two years in elevan man. Their first year in sixman was 5-5 before making the playoffs their second year in. They, not only had to learn how to win, but what it takes to win a close game. Experience in winning a close game is the only way to learn.

A few others that have had success either their first year in sixman or very soon there after: Valley, Ft. Davis and Sanderson. Maybe Rankin? Water Valley in their second year?

 

[truthhurts04]

#1) Schools/Communities hang on too long! They stay 11man as long as possible until all the kids are gone and play 6man as a last resort!

#2) Scheduling...Ive seen alot of 1st year 6man programs come out and schedule 5 top ten teams...they get blown out and lose all support and desire!

#3) Coaching...They keep or hire 11man guys that try to "re-invent" things..or they use 11man tactics such as punting from the opponents 35, ball control, rushing 6 on defense lol!? REALLY?

#4) Talent...6man is a skilled game, sometimes they just dont have it.

 

[WV Backer]

A few others that have had success either their first year in sixman or very soon there after: Valley, Ft. Davis and Sanderson. Maybe Rankin? Water Valley in their second year?

Yes, the WV did make the playoffs in their second year back in sixman. It was a rather inglorious how-do-you-do at the hands of Richland Springs (46-0) but it was the playoffs nonetheless. A better example would be Jayton who won the State Championship back-to-back in their first two years of sixman. Garden City has also been very successful since coming back to sixman; posting a record of 8-3 their first year back and claiming back-to-back State Championships within their first six years.

 

[Edward Golden]

Most schools that drop to Six Man are not usually doing that great in 11-man.

 

[Caprock kid]

Paducah made playoffs in 2003 in their last year at the 11-man level and won district every year till 2007. Some schools that drop just don't have the right athletes to compete or maybe the kids have a hard time learning the game but it also helps when the coaches and kids can pick up on the game and how to play it. A lot of talent never hurt anyone either.

 

[Johnny South]

Yes, the WV did make the playoffs in their second year back in sixman. It was a rather inglorious how-do-you-do at the hands of Richland Springs (46-0) but it was the playoffs nonetheless. A better example would be Jayton who won the State Championship back-to-back in their first two years of sixman. Garden City has also been very successful since coming back to sixman; posting a record of 8-3 their first year back and claiming back-to-back State Championships within their first six years.

I remember one thing about those Water Valley Wildcats, that team had just about the best spreadback that ever came along. He was just totally shut down when he came up against the R.S. defense and Jared Hicks and company.

 

[WindthorstFan3]

Paducah made playoffs in 2003 in their last year at the 11-man level and won district every year till 2007.

In Paducah's last year in 11-man I saw something I thought I would never see in a football game. We were playing them in bi-district and had a pretty good kicker. He was able to put the ball into the middle of end zone on kick-offs. Well needless to say Paducah on the opening kickoff their returner only made it out to the 10-15 yard line, we score kickoff and again the returner only get back to 10-15 yard line. So the next time we score the returner tries to return a deep kickoff out of the endzone, but was tackled by a teammate. Never seen anything like that before!!

 

[olderelk]

Paducah made playoffs in 2003 in their last year at the 11-man level and won district every year till 2007.

In Paducah's last year in 11-man I saw something I thought I would never see in a football game. We were playing them in bi-district and had a pretty good kicker. He was able to put the ball into the middle of end zone on kick-offs. Well needless to say Paducah on the opening kickoff their returner only made it out to the 10-15 yard line, we score kickoff and again the returner only get back to 10-15 yard line. So the next time we score the returner tries to return a deep kickoff out of the endzone, but was tackled by a teammate. Never seen anything like that before!!

A Stanford player did it in the 2012 Fiesta Bowl.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m5akCflfwtQ

 

[WV Backer]

Yes, the WV did make the playoffs in their second year back in sixman. It was a rather inglorious how-do-you-do at the hands of Richland Springs (46-0) but it was the playoffs nonetheless. A better example would be Jayton who won the State Championship back-to-back in their first two years of sixman. Garden City has also been very successful since coming back to sixman; posting a record of 8-3 their first year back and claiming back-to-back State Championships within their first six years.

I remember one thing about those Water Valley Wildcats, that team had just about the best spreadback that ever came along. He was just totally shut down when he came up against the R.S. defense and Jared Hicks and company.

"Just about the best spreadback that ever came along"? You are kidding, right? Tipton was good, really good but the best? Heck, he wasn't even the best spreadback on the field that night, Hicks was a better ballplayer. Even Cory Bledsoe from Panther Creek was just as good. No, Tipton may have been the best spreadback the WV has ever had (Doug Schwartz, Kellan Kirkland and Justin Hahn might have something to say about that) but the best ever... nah.

 

[Johnny South]

WV, I will rephrase my statement. I was in a little hurry and said "about the best". I meant to say "one of the best". I will say in that particular game, from where I sat, it seemed that the supporting cast folded long before the spreadback did.
Sure, Hicks was the better spreadback that year, not that the WV back couldn't have been just as good if all other factors were equal.

 

[WV Backer]

You are certainly correct about the supporting cast not being up to the challenge. Remember, Richland Springs was very good that year (when are they not good?) and the WV just couldn't match-up. That was Water Valley's first foray into the playoffs since 1946 so they were a bit new to it all. I distinctly remember the huge number of RS fans that night in Eden; you could tell this wasn't their first rodeo. If memory serves, they made it to the semi-finals and lost to Strawn on the last play of the game that year. I remember thinking afterwards that the Coyotes were destined for a state championship... just goes to show you never can tell.

As I said, Tipton was really good and very fast. Him and Daniel Sears were a really good one-two punch for the Wildcats in 2003. We could sure use him this year. In an ironic turn, last I heard he was coaching for Burkhart down at Richland Springs.

 

[texas man]

That whole season was just whack. Every one had RS in the state title game that year. If a spread back from Zephyr had not have got hurt against Strawn a week before it would have been RS vs Zephyr in the semis. RS had already beaten Zephyr earlier that year. Very good spread backs that year Hicks form RS, Temple for Zephyr and Tipton form WV.

 

[Schwarzenegger]

Paducah made playoffs in 2003 in their last year at the 11-man level and won district every year till 2007.

In Paducah's last year in 11-man I saw something I thought I would never see in a football game. We were playing them in bi-district and had a pretty good kicker. He was able to put the ball into the middle of end zone on kick-offs. Well needless to say Paducah on the opening kickoff their returner only made it out to the 10-15 yard line, we score kickoff and again the returner only get back to 10-15 yard line. So the next time we score the returner tries to return a deep kickoff out of the endzone, but was tackled by a teammate. Never seen anything like that before!!

I remember that game like it was yesterday. I think your being kind of generous saying Paducah got the ball out to the 10 to 15. I believe it was more like Paducah was only getting to the 5 yard line. The player that made the tackle was Jeremy Busby which was smart because then we could start off at the 20 instead of the 5! They needed all the yards they could get against that Windthorst squad! Whatever happen to those Green brothers I knew the youngest went to play at Midwestern but what about the older brothers?

 

[WindthorstFan3]

Kyle and Chad attended UMHB. Kyle played football for them but Chad's knees were bad. What also stuck out to me about that game was afterwards some of the Paducah players coming into our locker room and congratulating our kids and wishing them well. Never have seen that before and haven't since!!! I have been doing Windthorst's stats since '98.

It's somewhat amazing looking back at our history and seeing how many teams we use to play that are now 6man schools or don't exist.
Bryson 13-11-2 (Our 5th most played opponent)
WF Notre Dame 17-5
Throckmorton 13-7 (no the 6-man exhibition is not included in the record)
Saint Jo 15-3
Newcastle 8-9-1
Chillicothe 7-2
Woodson 5-4
Harrold 1-5-2
Knox City 2-3
Rule
Northside
Benjamin
Gorman
Paducah
Guthrie
Aspermont
Eden
Evant
Groom
Lometa
Nazareth
Rising Star
Jayton
Strawn

 

[Little Doc]

And we are glad to have every one of them!