The Future of all Those West Texas Windfarms

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The Future of all Those West Texas Windfarms

Postby Old Bearkat » Wed Jul 03, 2013 1:48 pm

When the subsidy bucket runs dry, as it soon will.

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http://knoxville.craigslist.org/pol/3746100243.html
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Re: The Future of all Those West Texas Windfarms

Postby Texman301 » Wed Jul 03, 2013 2:05 pm

I was told by the 4 landowners I know that has these that it is in their contractual obligations than when they agreement is over, the company has to come in and take them down including the concrete base down to between 10-12 ft below the surface. Each company has promised them by a year or two after they are gone, the landowners wont even know they were there.
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Re: The Future of all Those West Texas Windfarms

Postby Old Bearkat » Wed Jul 03, 2013 2:35 pm

Texman301 wrote:I was told by the 4 landowners I know that has these that it is in their contractual obligations than when they agreement is over, the company has to come in and take them down including the concrete base down to between 10-12 ft below the surface. Each company has promised them by a year or two after they are gone, the landowners wont even know they were there.


It's hard to enforce a contractural agreement on a defunct bankrupt company. ALL of the wind farm companies exist only because of both construction and operational subsidies, and exist only to fleece the taxpayers, ratepayers, and naive greens. They have no real hard structure underpinning revenues, much less profits and hide those deficeits under accounting tricks worth of Enron.
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Re: The Future of all Those West Texas Windfarms

Postby CT6MFL » Wed Jul 03, 2013 2:40 pm

can you say "scrap metal" :). I have a plasma cutter....
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Re: The Future of all Those West Texas Windfarms

Postby Old Bearkat » Wed Jul 03, 2013 2:44 pm

And my advice to those school districts, like Blackwell, who have become dependent upon windfarm revenue, don't spend that money for operations, because in at most 10 years, you won't have it. Windpower is an inefficient money pit that is definitely not "green".
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Re: The Future of all Those West Texas Windfarms

Postby Old Bearkat » Wed Jul 03, 2013 2:46 pm

CT6MFL wrote:can you say "scrap metal" :). I have a plasma cutter....


Goferit! You'll have to take down a lot of them in the winter when there are no crops to be damaged by falling towers.

I bet you could charge admission to people who'd love watching that happen.
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Re: The Future of all Those West Texas Windfarms

Postby oldfat&bald » Wed Jul 03, 2013 3:54 pm

Old Bearkat wrote:
CT6MFL wrote:can you say "scrap metal" :). I have a plasma cutter....


Goferit! You'll have to take down a lot of them in the winter when there are no crops to be damaged by falling towers.

I bet you could charge admission to people who'd love watching that happen.


Have you ever watched two old black men that can't hardly walk scrap out the metal tanks from an old grain elevator? It's amazing what you can do with a couple of cutting torches and a 48 model Chevy two ton truck equipped with a winch and gin poles.
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Re: The Future of all Those West Texas Windfarms

Postby oldfat&bald » Wed Jul 03, 2013 3:56 pm

Texman301 wrote:I was told by the 4 landowners I know that has these that it is in their contractual obligations than when they agreement is over, the company has to come in and take them down including the concrete base down to between 10-12 ft below the surface. Each company has promised them by a year or two after they are gone, the landowners wont even know they were there.


I know a guy that refused to have them put on his farm because they wouldn't agree to put that in the contract.
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Re: The Future of all Those West Texas Windfarms

Postby westexasflats » Wed Jul 03, 2013 5:08 pm

Now they fixin to start a new one in Goldthwaite
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Re: The Future of all Those West Texas Windfarms

Postby Blue Bird » Thu Jul 04, 2013 7:37 am

I saw the "parts" being hauled south through Comanche and wondered how far south they were going. Our tax dollar at work. There has to be electrical transmission infrastructure in place before the windmill goes up. The state is on the hook for most of that.
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Re: The Future of all Those West Texas Windfarms

Postby JAFO » Thu Jul 04, 2013 9:59 am

http://investorshub.advfn.com/Solar-Win ... WET-20011/ Here is something a little different.
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Re: The Future of all Those West Texas Windfarms

Postby Old Bearkat » Thu Jul 04, 2013 8:13 pm

JAFO wrote:http://investorshub.advfn.com/Solar-Wind-Energy-Tower-Inc-SWET-20011/ Here is something a little different.


JAFO, I've seen this before, and it still will require a government subsidy to get built and operate. The capital cost per MW to build exceeds a nuke plant, and I'll wager the 60% capacity factor they are assuming is about 50% higher than the actual will be. The 18% house load exceeds nuclear and gas fired generation and is comparable to a modern coal fired plant.
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Re: The Future of all Those West Texas Windfarms

Postby Old Bearkat » Fri Jul 05, 2013 12:39 pm

JAFO,

I went diging on this concept and found this little gem. This company tried scamming the Australian government into giving them a really big subsidy.

ROM says:
June 27, 2013 at 8:28 PM
The same outfit Enviromission had a big propaganda campaign here in Australia up to 3 or 4 years years ago on how they were going to build the same Solar Tower system some tens of kilometres north west of Mildura which is located on the Murray River in the south east of Australia.
They even bought a station property, Tapio Station [ "Station"; a large as in tens or usually in hundreds of square kilometres, outback livestock grazing property ] to build the first of a proposed 30 or 40 towers that were to stretch across Australia on about the same latitude. A latitude where it was claimed that the cloud cover was lowest for the whole continent.
At one point it was claimed that these 30 or 40 Enviromission solar towers would be able to supply all of Australia’s electrical needs.

I think it all fell down around the fact that the Australian government refused to pony up a fair lump of the finance required to build the first Solar Tower.
So the whole Enviromission outfit packed up and headed for the USA where they probably hoped the taxpayer’s pockets might be a little easier to pick.

There were also reports in the media that the power concentration output was so inferior per dollar and per area that the whole thing was completely uneconomic.
Measured against the current wind and solar energy performance and costs, if true, thats really saying something about the solar tower’s potential economic viability.

The other unknown which was never mentioned except amongst glider pilots was the very strong likelihood that with the very fast, concentrated updraught from the tower ie a massively strong thermal updraught source, there was likely to be cloud formation from the updraught of varying and quite possibly large extent directly over the tower and it’s surrounding glass covered, heat generating areas for long periods whenever the normal atmospheric conditions were suitable for even quite limited cumulous cloud formation.

The higher the Solar Tower and the stronger the air flow of the updraught up and out of the tower, the more likely such a tower and energy absorber would generate this semi permanent cloud cover formation directly over the entire tower and the critical to the entire operation of the system, the surrounding heat absorbing areas.

A smaller version such as was operating in Spain for those eight years would not suffer the cloud problem but the energy output would also be a few magnitudes lower in output as well

As an old glider pilot, all of us glider pilots were busting our backsides to see it built and have a go at soaring the Tower’s thermal updraught as Dr Spencer mentioned.
Probably would have been a bit like trying to soar in a stubble fire and that sort of shatters the teeth on occasions and it sometimes almost needs a change of underwear after a rough one.
Getting too damn old for that sort of teeth shattering excitement nowadays, unfortunately.

Enviromission’s web site has been toned down a heck of a lot from it’s Australian heyday of a few years back but here it is.
http://www.enviromission.com.au/EVM/con ... nologyover
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Re: The Future of all Those West Texas Windfarms

Postby JAFO » Fri Jul 05, 2013 6:36 pm

If I remember right Obama gave hundreds of millions to more than 7 losing bankrupt solar and other energy companies that abruptly went out of business . If Obama is not involved it has a chance to succeed.
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Re: The Future of all Those West Texas Windfarms

Postby Red_Devil_DDS » Thu Aug 29, 2013 4:43 pm

CT6MFL wrote:can you say "scrap metal" :). I have a plasma cutter....



FWIW, those windmills are made of metal and not plasma. Your tool would be a worthless gesture.
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